The 79% statistic does not seem true, at least if we’re assuming the American context. The sentiments around legal abortion are more similar than that between men and women, with 38% of men opposed and 33% of women opposed to legal abortion in most cases.
As one of the 21% who support abortion I think this statement is a little cavalier. The numbers tell more than one story.
It’s not saying that 79% of men are abortion opponents.
It’s saying that 79% of abortion opponents are men.
Those two statements are very different.
Oh yeah I read it wrong. Nevertheless, the point is that this one statistic doesn’t tell a whole story.
Here’s a pew research thing finding about 61% of men supporting abortion in the US in 2024; lagging behind women at 64% but not by much
Nice. Research shows 5 out of 4 polls are misleading.
Well, one is a poll, one is a meme with no data source or explanation of what’s been done to get to the possibly not very correct number
i think that we should start referring to it as child sacrifice++
Weird how many pro-lifers also support the death penalty.
So if we make refusal to vacate a uterus a capital offense, we have a path to compromise
Plenty of men support abortion - it removes financial responsibility from them, after all. Protests at abortion clinics are often held by women as much as men.
The more important demographic here is that most opposed to abortion are strongly religious.
Look outside the US and you’ll see that countries that do support choice are less influenced by the Church. It’s not coincidence.
Almost as if claiming a simple statistic tells the whole story doesn’t tell the whole story.
And many of the men who oppose abortions, are massive fucking hypocrits who will gladly have their mistress get an abortion somewhere else.
And of the women, probably 1/3rd of them are post-menopausal and won’t have any more kids either
No they don’t. They only tell half the story.
The fact that the remaining 21% regularly go to abortion clinics anyway and tell the doctors that they will go to hell for giving them an abortion even as they demand one tells the other half.
I would encourage you to read the post more carefully. It doesn’t say anything about how many men oppose abortion. It’s making a claim about how many abortion opponents are men. Therefore, the 21% left over in that statement are in fact women who, most likely due to religious brainwashing, oppose abortion.
Wow… I’m in the 21% who don’t oppose abortion and I also don’t go to clinics to harass the doctors, so apparently the story has at least 3 halves.
if you don’t oppose abortion then you’re not in that 21%
This is erasure of the like, 1 maybe 2, trans men that are anti-abortion
Yeah I kind of thought the statement was somehow obliquely anti-trans, but I didn’t want to open that can of arsenic.
trans men that are anti-abortion
Well, allow me to be inclusive and say that both cis- and trans men who oppose aborion deserve a very equal kick to the face.
I wish it was that few, but sadly trans people can have some really atrocious politics too. I doubt they’re a significant factor on this particular scenario, though.
Turns out that assholes are roughly evenly distributed through the population, unfortunately.
Co-worker once told me managers are like assholes, everybody has at least one.
Doesn’t really matter because the supermajority of Americans think abortion should be legal anyway. It’s a small minority of the population that we have allowed to dictate domestic policy for their religious agenda.
It’s not even religious. Their religion says all kinds of really important shit that they completely ignore. They just pick this one specific issue because they hate women and it’s a lot easier to say “Uhhhh it’s because of my religion, you’re discriminating against me!” than it is to say “I hate women and want them to suffer”.
I think that’s confusing simple ignorance and crappy reasoning with hate, which is a very misapplied word today. Another example is people who don’t recycle - they don’t hate the environment, they’re just fucking lazy.
Their motivations are still religious. Scripture and belief/practice often do not coincide or outright contradict each other.
Oh come now. They don’t hate women, they just want to punish women for having sex outside of marriage because it’s against…their… religion…
…hm.
I think even that is reaching. Most of them don’t want to punish women for extramarital sex, they just think God’s will is that those women deserve what they get. Of course they still defy God’s will by wearing glasses if God gave them bad eyes, but that’s just more shoddy reasoning.
Also not in the religion, they’re specifically instructed that they’re not to make judgements or enact any punishments on the behalf of god, which this is.
It’s religious leaders saying this stuff. It isn’t in scripture. Not Christian scripture, at any rate.
Reminds me of how some at the GOP was making a joke that it makes no sense for women over 50 to even care about abortion rights cause it doesn’t apply to them anymore.
Yet he saw no problem with him, as a man who can never carry a child, having an opinion on abortions.
Where did she get that number? Where’s the source?
Majorities of both men (61%) and women (64%) express support for legal abortion.
38% of men are against abortion, and 33% of women are against.
The numbers are pretty similar.
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/fact-sheet/public-opinion-on-abortion/
Ok, my first thought was “no way” but different areas of the country are different, so I was open to digging in. Looks like my gut was right, it’s just more “alternative facts.”
“the country” which country is that?
My home country, assuming the average wouldn’t be far off
Thanks, the story she was telling was counter-intuitive and without source. Hence, doubt!
Those are different numbers, percentage of men who are against abortion and percentage of people against abortion who are men are not the same.
Doesn’t matter. If you take those numbers, let’s say 4 out of 10 men are against abortion, so you put them in a pile.
Then you take 3 out of 10 women against abortion and you put them in the same pile.
So now you have a pile with 4 men and 3 women who are against abortion. Which would mean 4/7 people who are against abortion are men. Which is 57%. Not 79% at all.
Either way. What’s the source. Should always source your statistics.
It does matter, you’re assuming that they surveyed equal number of men and women, but I don’t see anywhere on that site that indicates that. Example in which op could be correct along with the statistics from (or close enough because I am on my phone and can’t get too complicated). Let’s create our dataset that could fit both results, let’s say they surveyed 100 people, 74 men and 26 women. From that 36 people are against abortion, 28 men and 8 women. So 36% of people surveyed are against abortion( This part matches the overall %s from the survey). Those 28men make up 78% of the people against abortion (this part matches OP). If we calculate them within each gender, 38% of the men are against abortion and 29% of women are against abortion (numbers got a little different here, but it’s close to the survey results). I am assuming that they didn’t have equal number of men and women, that’s why they stayed away from that calculation.
Your point is probably still generally correct because the percentage of men and women in the population is close to 50% each but in general the argument doesn’t work unless you have equal numbers of both in the population.
82% of statistics are made up on the spot. Everyone knows that.
69% of the time, it works every time
nice
deleted by creator
68% of people believe in made-up numbers. 71% even, if the numbers sound random enough.
If men could get pregnant, there would be drive-through abortion clinics every 5 miles
Men can get pregnant.
In any significant quantity, i guess.
They need female parts for that buddy.
Men can have female parts. About 1% of men are born with a vagina and uterus. Drag personally knows several men like this.
With all due buddy: “If cisgender men could get pregnant…, …with a drive thru haha every five freedom units I’m dunny with the funny” would slap, contrasted to choosing to erase trans men, which catches hands.
With all due buddy
i’m stealing this
It was root to leave out the slugs
Honestly it’s absolutely shocking that there are anti-abortion women at all tbh but it’s also in the same country where half the country wants to elect an inept treasonous convict
Those numbers are horseshit though, lol. There is no significant difference between the sexes on this topic:
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/fact-sheet/public-opinion-on-abortion/
Majorities of both men (61%) and women (64%) express support for legal abortion.
Abortion isn’t a ‘battle of the sexes’ topic, and you should be wary of anyone perpetuating this myth. In my experience, those most likely to do so, are those who see men in general as ‘the enemy’, and use this narrative as a tool to confirm and spread their bias.
It is perfectly fine being anti-abortion for personal beliefs, but to be anti-choice for others is shocking.
It isn’t really shocking if you look at it objectively and see from their perspective for a moment.
A genuine pro-lifer, by definition, believes that abortion is morally equivalent to murdering a newborn, because the unborn is equivalent to a baby, to them.
So imagine how such a person would read what you just said:
It is perfectly fine being against murder for personal beliefs, but to be against giving others the choice to murder is shocking.
It’s understandable that the above sentiment would come off like the words of a madman.
Because there is truly no ‘debate’ to actually be had about whether or not one believes the unborn ‘count’ as babies, it’s completely futile to argue with pro-lifers on that axis.
Nor should one be surprised that they are ‘anti choice for others’ when itI comes to this, as I am sure you are against others having the choice to murder at will, regardless of whether you wish to murder anyone.
It’s like saying that it’s shocking that a hypothetical group of people who believe theft is the worst possible crime you can commit, believe in capital punishment for thieves. Sure, it sounds bizarre to everyone else, but it shouldn’t be surprising at all that they feel that way, given that they believe.
Even as a personal belief it can be problematic when it causes harm to children you have while your own life circumstances don’t really make that a good idea (e.g. being gravely ill and dying soon after the birth, leaving the child a predictable orphan; having genetic diseases that will kill any children you have after significant suffering with no chance of a cure;…). There are always at least two people to consider in any decision not to abort, even if one is only a future potential person (but unlike the decision to abort, where that person does not exist in that future, when they are born they actually can suffer).
there are a lot of women in jeebus camp who’ve been indoctrinated since birth to do what they’re told by men. they argue that it frees them of the ‘burden’ of thinking for themselves and making their own decisions. because the belief that those things are too much work for a woman is part of the indoctrination
A lot of working class men and enbies are taught to think that way too when it comes to questioning Capital or the government. Most people want to avoid pain and effort. If society tells them that taking responsibility for their own lives is painful, they won’t do it. Look at how many people “hate talking about politics”. It’s learned helplessness. They don’t want to be involved in making the decisions that affect their lives. They want a strong person to do it for them. That’s why fascism is able to fester.
Rich people know that they are exempt to most rules and sometimes they just want to impose them on others.
100%
How many of these anti abortion politicians have sent their mistresses out of state for abortions, probably even pressuring or coercing them using their more advanced legal, financial, and social standings?
Need babies for war
And if these women had an ectopic pregnancy they’d be the first in line to abort it while denying that right to other women.
Well, a lot of women think life begins at conception, not at birth. And yeah, complications happen, but that’s life.
Before Roe v. Wade were overturned I was critical about abortion, then we started hearing about all the trouble women go through and it shows how essential abortion is for reducing birth complications, even if it sounds illogical.
My main issue were when abortion was used as contraceptive, because at the time of abortion the body is increasing hormone production and then it’s tough on the woman emotionally when the fetus is removed, but then I learn that in those states sex-ed is very limited and contraceptives can be hard to get hold of. And without sex-ed and contraceptives abortion is the only option left.
In light of all that I now know why we need abortion and feel like a fool for opposing it.
because at the time of abortion the body is increasing hormone production and then it’s tough on the woman emotionally when the fetus is removed
I applaud you changing your mind in face of new information, I just kind of want to nitpick that being forced to carry a pregnancy that you don’t want to term is also going to be extremely physically and emotionally tough.
As a relative to a parent, who’s grandparents didn’t even want them but had to give birth to my parents, due to society stigma at the time, it honestly genuinely not worth it, esp with the amount of trauma my parent (dad) had to endure, due to not being loved and cared for, which has lead to further trauma extended to me too, due to unresolved pain. Abortion is a necessity. It saves lives alongside, helping people not suffer from further trauma and pain for the future for themselves and kids as well.
I’m curious, is there ANY evidence of ‘abortion as contraceptive’ happening?
Well, sort of. In that in states that teach abstinence-only sexual education, there is a higher rate of teen pregnancy. I’m guessing you could extrapolate from that and find that teen abortion rates are higher, but I don’t have that data.
As I like to say to “pro-life” people: “Want to reduce abortion? Make contraception free and teach comprehensive sexual education.”
That’s the thing though. They aren’t pro life. They are anti sex that they don’t approve of.
Pregnancy is punishment for you having sex outside of marriage.
Which…tells you exactly what they think of women.
That’s the thing though. They aren’t pro life. They are anti sex that they don’t approve of.
Sure, but they don’t think of themselves that way. They see themselves as trying to stop what they see as murder. Yes, they ALSO don’t want people having sex that they don’t approve of, but data clearly shows higher rates of unplanned pregnancy in states that don’t teach people how not to get pregnant. So if they truly see abortion as horrendous, they should be trying to stop unplanned pregnancies before they occur.
Pointing out that dissonance can help them see the flaw in their reasoning, if they’re introspective enough to attempt consistency in their views.
(Source: My own life story, having grown up as the sufficiently introspective “pro-lifer” shown the flaws in my thinking as part of a long journey from a conservative youth to a progressive adult. 😅)
I suspect it is one of those things that conservatives imagine being all over the place because in their communities where they would be shamed for becoming pregnant while unmarried and where contraceptives are hard to get that is how they imagine they would handle it.
Yeah, that’s what I thought.
I also applause your willingness to change your mind based on new facts learned and please don’t take this as an attack because it isn’t, it’s just a curiosity of mine. Did body autonomy not factor into your previous stance? I’m sure we both agree woman are perfectly capable of making their own decisions with their own body, why does anyone need to be involved in what they choose to do.
Tangentially related but I saw a state in the US basically made it so rapists could choose the mother of their children by both having abortion be illegal and making it so rapists could share parental rights with their victim. Essentially forcing the mother to be involved with their abuser. Shits crazy yo.
Regarding bodily autonomy, my previous stance were something like this: Abortion is a major decision and women should be counselled to make sure they know what they go into, and maybe try and convince them to keep it.
And that stance is probably fine if we lived in a perfect world where a few women got pregnant by accident, and it were the only reason for abortion.
But live in a world with: rapists, incest, teen pregnancy, ectopic pregnancy, failing contraceptics, and many other reasons for abortion.
So I can only agree that the only way forward is full bodily autonomy.
That’s a fair enough stance even if I don’t fully agree with it. I definitely agree with the counseling so people can make the decision that’s best for them but I don’t believe anyone should try and convince them one way or the other.
Thanks for giving me some of your time bud. Hope you have a good rest of your week.
Yup, and I’m still critical of abortion, but because of similar stuff to what you said, my official position is essentially pro-abortion, with some caveats to discourage things I find truly awful (e.g. no abortion after learning the gender unless it’s for a medical emergency).
My main issue were when abortion was used as contraceptive
What does this even mean? That’s literally all abortions?
From what I gather contraceptives ensures that the egg is not fertilized or not produced.
Whereas abortions is done after implantation.
Good point, in which case no abortion could ever be conctraceptive
99% of people who are opposed to murder will never be murdered, the numbers speak for themselves.
Pro choice just thought the argument was a little funny lol
They can be murdered though, unlike being pregnant, which I think is the point. The wording should better reflect that.
There are men who can be pregnant it’s just not the norm
How many trans men are against abortion? I doubt it’s any significant percent of their demographic
not with that attitude
They all could be the victim though.
Men can get pregnant too it’s just not the norm
I’d say the intersection between “men who can get pregant” and “men who strongly oppose abortion” has to be almost nonexistant.
And the intersection between murderers and those opposed to murders is almost non existent.
Man am I regreting using murder as an analogy I really should’ve thought that through a bit better in hindsight XD
Wouldn’t 99% of people who are opposed to murder will never be a murderer the more reflective statement here?
Also pro-choice.
Ye you’re right I’m a failure of a commenter 😭
